WAR (Warhammer Online)

I don't really care.

On one hand you've got official forums which do turn into the whine/complaint fests ala WoW.   On the other hand if they have no forum it could be a slight problem.

I believe they are doing the same thing they did with DAoC, the Camelot herald was a fantastic source of real, solid, information without all the extra fluff.  I spent each day there while playing DAoC, and I'll probably go to the War Herald each day as well.

Originally posted by Areel

2.  Official forums allow the Community Managers to only have to visit one site.  They want to post a message?  One stop posting.  They want to gauge the general ideas of the community?  They're all in one spot.  And Community Managers know the difference between random whining and serious concerns.

The downside?  Community Managers with official forums often get the soul-crushing job of being a forum Moderator.  Much of their time is wasted on locking threads, editing objectionable material, and otherwise dealing with the assholes.  That means that they're less inclined to share their knowledge with the community.  People also start to EXPECT a dev reply.  So many meaningless threads that start with the title, "Devs, plz respond!"

Then again, many Vanguard players today, after the official forum was closed, feel adrift.  There is no centralized voice, and they are scattered to the winds.

But some of us, myself included like visiting all the different fansites. I like how the communites on each are so different and varied. They all offer a different atmosphere. They allow the different players to find a community that is most comfortable to them, rather than forcing them to all congregate in one.

3.  Forums do not create the community.  The community creates the atmosphere of the forum.  For this, let's look at two games that were recently in development, and had official forums.  Lord of the Rings Online, and Vanguard.  LotRO had a very calm, friendly forum environment during development.  Interesting discussions were common, and trolls and flames were kept to a minimum.  On the other hand, Vanguard's community started out with an ego problem, and it showed in their forums.  Anything negative about the game was shot down.  Flamers and asshats prowled through every post.

Essentially, it's the people that define how an official forum will develop.  Not the pressence of an official forum, itself.

Really, I think the pros outweigh the cons.  But I admit that there is no perfect solution.  Official forums have both advantages and disadvantages.  I just hope the WAR community won't be fractured by the absence of a central community.

Originally posted by beauxaj

I don't really care.

On one hand you've got official forums which do turn into the whine/complaint fests ala WoW.   On the other hand if they have no forum it could be a slight problem.

I believe they are doing the same thing they did with DAoC, the Camelot herald was a fantastic source of real, solid, information without all the extra fluff.  I spent each day there while playing DAoC, and I'll probably go to the War Herald each day as well.

Originally posted by Richard_Mythic

Originally posted by Justice87

My vote is for that its a good thing they arent having any Official boards. All they should have is a Tech support chat. Where you can connect with a tech support employee and get one on one help...Kinda like Myth Wars has. (see more details on Myth Wars site)

There can be many different manners to contact tech support without needing Forums to do it.

Agreed.  But one can't deny how invaluable official forums are, in terms of gathering the community together in an organized fashion.  Plus it facilitates easier (and more efficient) information sharing, and one cannot minimize the perceived "direct line of communication" effect that they have on the customer base.

I've been working in the software industry for a decade now (yeah I'm getting old), primarily supporting the US govt.  One thing that has never been lost on me, is how important it is to give the customer the ability to address concerns, suggestions, or information sharing amongst the community in an organized manner.  For games, it allows the users some catharsis just to vent at the CMs; for others, it allows them to discuss class tips, techniques, or game quests amongst each other in one centralized location.

And even with all the bashing we do of WoW, one has to objectively admit that their forums work -- very well.  Sure, there's a whole lot of complaining that goes on.  But many of us used the forums on a daily basis to get insight into crafting, class skills, and upcoming game changes.  In today's online gaming communities, and with how pervasive the Web is, IME it doesn't make business sense to *not* have official forums.

Originally posted by Richard_Mythic

Originally posted by Traelin

Originally posted by checkthis500
And the whining is the reason why I don't like official forums.  It's the only thing that isn't offered by unofficial forums.

One of the beauties of official forums is that, like any other forum, you don't HAVE to read them...so I don't see why the whining would bother you.  On the other hand, forums do offer a direct line of communication to the devs (via the CMs), as well as valuable resources on class-based, game-based, quest-based, etc. issues.  To me it signifies a level of professionalism if you will.

But why does it need to be official forums to provide that "direct line of communication to the devs (via the CMs)"... These aren't official forums, yet here I (the CM in question) am responding to your post...

Because, as has been witnessed in every other online game without official forums, it becomes a pain for the customer to follow several different fansites.  Really what it comes down to, is that the customer is inconvenienced...and that is becoming too common of a trend these days in the software industry.

I'll even expand it beyond gaming.  Too often I have been called in to solve some bad IT situations, and you would be surprised how all of it could have been solved in a much more expeditious and pleasing manner if there was good COMMUNICATION -- in most of my cases, it was vis-a-vis meetings, but in others it was building a solid website with discussion groups and forums.

I simply cannot stress enough how important it is for the customer to feel like 1. He/she is being heard, and 2. He/she isn't inconvenienced by running around looking for answers.

Its funny, a majority of the replies here support the decision to not have official forums...

But looking at the poll numbers.... over 50% of the respondents think its a bad choice.... while 32% don't really care...(mostly because they aren't into forums)......

but sure...lets not have official forums....

and please, stop pointing at DAOC's successes w/o forums.... they released a game killing expansion because they were totally out of touch with their core gamers, it was a niche game compared to EQ and others (and I still play DAOC btw) and the lack of a good forum was a negative..not a positive.... no matter how many arguments Richard tosses up to support the decision.

You could argue that my "opinion" is no more valid than Richards... except that I'm the one paying his salary... so it carries a bit more weight....

Originally posted by Richard_Mythic

But some of us, myself included like visiting all the different fansites. I like how the communites on each are so different and varied. They all offer a different atmosphere. They allow the different players to find a community that is most comfortable to them, rather than forcing them to all congregate in one.And I'll never be accused of modding someone's post simply because I didn't like what they said. I have, and never will have, no mod powers on any fan site. If a post gets deleted here, it's cause you broke MMORPG.com's rules, not because you posted something Mythic didn't want to hear.

Sure, there are a lot of people that enjoy going to different forums.  But put yourself in the shoes of your typical gamer nowadays.  Most of us, believe it or not, are 25+ years old.  Most of us have jobs, lives, and all the other great stuff that life throws at us -- i.e., we are casual/core gamers.  I for one don't want to be spending my time away from the game by scanning several different forums; and if one is truly objective about it, one will find I am the typical gamer in 2007.

Now one could make the argument that this game *may* not be meant for the casual gamer.  But I highly doubt that's the case, since when you get down to the meat of it, it is being made for money.  The more the better...which means catering to the casual gamer.

Really, there are only two arguments against official forums that hold any water. 1. The immediate cost of implementing them, in terms of 1-2 web developers, a sys admin, servers, and other overhead costs; and 2. The ability for the dev team to keep the customer at bay.  IMHO, the immediate costs are greatly outweighed by the benefit of the official forums and what they provide to the community.

Just my $.02.