All Posts by Khalathwyr

Currently crafting level is tied to adventure level (1-80) and not your pvp level (a separate 1-20), so you will have to fight some creatures to get levels to open crafting higher tiered items. Unless you have an existing medical condition I don't think combat will be too un-wieldly when fighting npcs. Again, it didn't look like they were doing hand-stands in the Oslo event videos that Avery and others posted. I'm sure you could always make friends in game too and they'd help you hunt as well.

Miss my Doctor in SWG and crafting and selling pharmeceuticals.  SOE and NGE= Epic Fail.

We have a very long while I believe before we have any more AAA companies making a MMO that is of the sandbox variant. SWG was the last, and the game company suits out there blindly attribute the, IMO, dwindling numbers and bad reputation SOE has gotten to the style of game it was, instead of the game they turned it into (NGE).

So, we'll just have to wait until some company takes that bold step again, but this time sticks to it's format, and in turn will create the next big MMO. Companies want to make MMOGs instead of Massively Multiplayer Online Worlds at the moment.

Originally posted by singsofdeath

Originally posted by admriker4

First off, GW isnt a quasi FPS. It has auto-target and auto-attack.

Second, GW is just like any other MMORPG. I dont recall it being anywhere near as complex as your setup. My typical setup for all MMO's is keymap controls to arrow keys (i dont do WASD). Then I point/click with my mouse on the bar where my specials are located. Simple, easy, and proven method Ive been using for 20 years of PC gaming.

AoC fans better be ready for a shock in subscriber numbers. The fact is quasi fps games for MMO's dont work. They fail miserably. 50k players is a success for that genre. The talk of being a WoW killer is way off base.

My thinking is Funcom's suits must know this but dont care. Theyve designed the game for xbox360 users which of course is a great risk.

It's this kind of attitude that is the reason that most of the games that come out these days are what everyone loves to call "clones" of WoW. It's this kind of attitude that makes Developers design their games along the standards. All the while, people are shouting for changes and for innovative things and for new things and when a company actually does it, they flame them for doing it? Is this a joke? FunCom at least is making an effort to change things, to improve on existing gameplay, to make it more fun and fast-paced. You won#t get any "Next-Gen" Games if nobody tries something new. Now I don't know how the Combat-System will work out, I may even, at some point, realize I hate it, but at least I am willing to give it a chance instead of mindlessly whining that it's too complicated.

Very well said Sings. Very well.

Originally posted by admriker4

 

Originally posted by AmazingAvery

 

Originally posted by Munkyman1

my bigest concern is that it will be clunky, and with how they are cutting so many things back, and taking things out till later, i worry that they will rush to many things for a release date....they will kick themselves later for it...they will, i think it will flop, which is to bad, because it has some fun aspects, nothing necessarily new but fun...to bad. sorry to say AoC is shaping up to be a release flop

Combat is awesome, honestly. Merging two classes has no resemblence on how you fight does it :/

 

Animations are awesome and smooth, no auto attack is a godsend as people have to pay attention.

No combat mechanics have been taken out, all that happened was they made it when you start you get 3 directions not 5, at level 40 you get the rest at this point in time.

Its shaping up to be really successfull, hope you get into Beta and had the same experience when I played it at their offices.

Reminds me of Guild Wars but better animations, more choices and you have to concentrate.

 

Instead of just claiming its gonna be awesome, how about some details ?

Can you explain whats so awesome about the combat that seems to designed for a gamepad to play ? How am I to use specials when my two hands will be busy trying to keep in range and direction and clicking that rose thing at the same time ?

How exactly is no auto-target / auto attack a benefit besides as you state "makes people pay attention" ? As several others here have posted, this is a vital feature mmorpg gamers come to expect and desire for their gamplay. Many of us hate fps type clickfests.

Name one single MMO that has more than 50k subscribers that utilizes a quasi-fps system with no auto-target or auot-attack. There arent any. I think Funcom is making a huuuge mistake.

Or...you could go to the TTH site and watch non-nda breaking videos of the fansite event Avery and other went to this past January where the video shows them sitting a gamepad-less computer and doing just fine with mouse and keyboard. Looks like to me you just don't want to make the effort to find the answers to your "concerns". They are out there. You just have to be willing to look for them.

Agree with Joe to an extent. Memberships like that, you are only seeing those gamers who like to hang out on message boards and such. there are many more less vocal/visible RPers (both who like and also dislike PvP) out there. They just prefer not to hang out on message boards and be called weirdos, noobs, carebears, etc, etc.

I always found it funny how these people (yeah, I said these people) talk about "true roleplay" and such. It's just funny how they want to dictate to others how/what roleplay is and yet if you try to apply a roleplay set that has an element they don't like, then oh my god, we can't have that. Rar Rar Rar.

Thorn, if you want the dev panel videos over at TTH you'll see a (imo distrubing) response by Gaute about how FC "views" RP. From his words, it seems RP equates to different fighting rulesets, and not the typical idea of what most gamers think when they hear RP server. Most of us think a ruleset like DAoC had on it's servers, where you had to "speak" in character in certain channels and there were naming conventions, etc.

Now, that's just what I got from the vids. Won't know until we actually see the RP "rules" that are applied. Additionally, the inclusion of RP PvE servers has not been totally ruled out. Athelan mentions it still a possibility in his dev blog on this site and some fan sites are still making FC aware that there is a substantial amount of gamers who play who are not PvP fanatics but still like to RP and would enjoy having a DAoC style ruleset.

Honestly, as it wouldn't hurt anyone who wanted to play on a RP PvP server if they included RP PvE servers, I don't see why some pro RP PvP people rail against having RP PvE servers. They won't have to play on them, it allows more choice and thus may attract more gamers. The only reason I can see is they are just mean-spirited.

Originally posted by admriker4

 

Originally posted by ethion

I'm also a bit concerned about the combat system.  While unique it is seeming like it might be rather devoid of any strategy...

So far what I've seen is you fight by being positioned near the enemy.  Then you hit ~ I think it was to go into combat mode.  Then you hit number keys like 1-3 or maybe it was 5.  Basically you hit the side without the shield.  Now I'm understanding there are combos that might mix this up some so you have to hit like 1-3-2 and it does some special bonus damage?

Ok so here are my concerns, it sounds like the UI is going to be kinda cumbersome.  If position is important esp in pvp then I am going to need to be moving a lot while I'm fighting.  This means that using wasd to move and mouselook won't leave any room for me to also be hitting 1,2,3.  So combat is going to be a coordination exercise?  Or maybe I'm supposed to use the mouse to attack which means that I'll be watching the rose quite a bit which means I'll really be focused on the UI and not the fight... Or perhaps the combat system is really designed around a game console gamepad which is kinda odd since it is coming out for a PC first??

Another thing, where are the skills and abilities you see in most other game?  Do I also have these types of abilities, you know kicks, bleed attacks, snares, taunt, etc?  Do I put these on buttons 4-0?  Or do I need to click these with the mouse in addition to all the other dancing I'm doing on the keyboard?  And If I'm doing the 1,2,3 thing constantly won't it be a challenge to also do the rest of the buttons at the same time to do special attacks if in fact there are any?

Seems to me like other then the rose thing there isn't really a lot of info on the combat system or have I missed out on it with all the hype focused on the rose?

 

 

This is my concern as well.

Combat systems like this one require either a 3rd hand or a gamepad. How the heck am I supposed to click specials, the rose thingie for direction of my attacks, AND keep moving into position of the enemy ?

This leads me to believe there are no snares, bleeds, stopping shots, knockdown, etc type specials or if they exist they dont matter much. It has been my experience in these recent quasi FPS type games that specials are window dressing and dont matter much...see Tabula Rasa, Star Wars Galaxies, Auto Assault, and others.

The more I read and think about this combat system, the more I dislike it. FPS genre doesnt belong in MMO's. It makes armor and weapon stats obsolete. It wont matter if my weapon is a legendary sword that I busted my rear to get if I cant keep a mob in range bleh. Reflexes, a steady hand, etc will win out over better gear and thats just silly. It defeats the whole point of an MMO. Might as well go the Halo route and make all gear the same and rely on the player's reflexes.

Perhaps the combat system is designed to work best on a console. And considering the type of gamer that plays on consoles, this fps might appeal to them. But not me honestly. I play MMO's to see my avatar get powerful from my time and effort. If I want to lose to someone who has better hand-eye cooridination Ill play Halo

I realize you may not have time in your schedule to look at other AoC fansites, videos or interviews, and that you may be limited to just checking this site, but the devs have confirmed that there are snares, dots, knockdowns etc in game. The non-nda breaking info/videos are out there, you just have to spend some time looking.

Originally posted by admriker4

 

Originally posted by Sharajat

 

Originally posted by admriker4

Yeesh,

No offense but that sounds awful. I dont care for buttons-smashing type games at all. In fact I despise them.

Can I just be a crafter like in SWG if I prefer ?

Oh my god.  This is so far away from a fighting game system it really isn't funny.  This isn't going to be the insane timing of fighting games (frame counting indeed)

 

That being said, if you're not looking to fight people constantly, than Conan really isn't your IP.  Warhammer really won't do it for you either.  I'd look at Fallen Earth.  

 

I did follow Fallen Earth for a while as Im a huge Fallout series fan and the game seems similiar.

However Fallen Earth is a FPS, that killed it pretty much for me. Still Im sorta following it in the hopes that I can be a crafter of some type without having to get involved with combat.

You can craft, but your craft tier access is tied in with your PvE level. Yes, at current it takes level 40 before you can craft, however, they are seriously looking at moving this to level 20 for retail launch. As they really don't mean for you to leave Tortage until 20 anyway, that would make sense. 

Originally posted by admriker4

 

Originally posted by whozthisguy

"Why cant AoC allow me to simply be a musician or a crafter in Cimmeria ? Why cant I just spend my time in any MMO decorating my home and building things ?"

i'm pretty sure AoC will have that. hell, you will be able to build your own buildings and eventually your own damn city. u can do nothing but craft if u want, i'm certian u'll be able to decorate your cyberhome too. but it probably just wont be end game. is that the problem? u want making pottery to be end game?

basically you want to be a cyber musician or decorate your cyber home? what exactly is wrong with REAL LIFE? i am a real musician and i decorate my real home, but i wanna go on epic raids and slaughter ppl. not exaclty allowed to do that in real life. cyber worlds? exactly like the one we actually live in? comeon...

 

from what Ive read, you cant craft in AoC until you reach like level 40. And crafting is a secondary skill, not a primary choice like we had with SWG.

AoC is nothing like a virtual world SWG or Ultima was. Its a step back

SWG wasn't a failure. The suits at SOE are the failure. They made the decision to radically change a game that was doing well and had a decent sub base. By taking SWG away from the skill based sandbox form and copying the level based form, they helped further perpetuate the myth that this is the style that all gamers want. Now all the suits force devs to do is put a new visual coat on "new" games, polish the raid and PvP content and ship. And we (gamers) continue to buy it, play it for 6 months and then quit playing.

In my opinion the only way for this cycle to stop is for a AAA company to embrace the skill based sandbox style of old and make a real attempt at a game. No endgame content (which, since there are no levels this should be easy). The company that instills the idea of a beginning with no end, and packs that with solid content and truly allows players to "build" in the world, that game will have success. Today's games only focus on polishing the "destroy" aspects, in my opinion.

Originally posted by Jazu

Come oooon FC - don't bullshit us this time

1) ordered a 360 version

2) didn't pay attention and allowed the store clerk to order a 360 version at initial pre-order

3) Got a store clerk who doesn't play MMOs and/or does not keep up with the MMO genre news

In the immortal words of Butthead, "Settle down, Beavis". Until we actually see/hear wolves, let's not cry out.

Originally posted by altairzq

Originally posted by Khalathwyr

Originally posted by altairzq

What I don't want is someone thinking we are all stupid and will believe that pushing buttons is "fun, exhilarating and real action". That's bullshit.

If pushing buttons isn't fun, then why do you game? Serious question. Gaming, in general, boils down to pushing/clicking buttons. I know if I didn't find it fun, well, I wouldn't do it. I know that I have found playing some games exhilirating in the past, so I see no reason this can't be. Real Action? Well, lol, I was in the Army for 8 years. I've seen real action. I know this isn't going to simulate anything I've done in life. But relative to other games in this genre, it may be more "real action" oriented. More interactive at least. Time will tell.

One thing is pushing buttons with some thought in it. But what I saw in that video that AmazingAvery posted in this forum is to push right if the icon representing the enemy shield is on the left, and push left button if the icon is on the right. Exhilarating? wow yes. How can you guys defend that crap?

I applaud them for daring to try something different, and should it work well, they will get a well-deserved success. I also won't argue that some folks in these companies get a little excited. That Paul guy for WAR is an example. But hey, they have to. They are trying to make a sale. Strangely I can understand that Paul guy b/c I worked for GW and I know the "Loud boisterous assault on the customer" approach that is preached to retail employees.

For me, the most important part is the guy is excited about his work. I mean, I'd be worried if the guy said "Yeah, we have combat...it's ok". I don't see his words as an assualt on my, or any reasonable gamer's intelligence (note, that is not a dig at you; but you've seen the ones I'm referring to, the ones screaming OMGz!!! NO!!!!Nerf!!!!!). Just an impassioned speech about his product.

Originally posted by Souvec

For a MMO that touts its superior graphics... why are we still left with static bows. When an archer lines up for a shot, I would expected to see that bowstring in the hand of the archer, not to mention an actual arrow.

The environment looks "pretty" but I would have hoped to see a bit more realism considering thats all it seems to be focusing. Perhaps I'm nitpicking but I expected more.

Those screens are after the arrow has been released (one image even shows the damage dealt floating above the target). There are vids out there that will show what you state you expect to see.

Originally posted by altairzq

What I don't want is someone thinking we are all stupid and will believe that pushing buttons is "fun, exhilarating and real action". That's bullshit.

If pushing buttons isn't fun, then why do you game? Serious question. Gaming, in general, boils down to pushing/clicking buttons. I know if I didn't find it fun, well, I wouldn't do it. I know that I have found playing some games exhilirating in the past, so I see no reason this can't be. Real Action? Well, lol, I was in the Army for 8 years. I've seen real action. I know this isn't going to simulate anything I've done in life. But relative to other games in this genre, it may be more "real action" oriented. More interactive at least. Time will tell.

Originally posted by elvenangel

 

Originally posted by Khalathwyr

 

I know this is an A,B conversation, but I had to but in. I'm guessing you were talking about the trials of Atlantis expansion, among other things?

 

Either way I've played DAoC and I've worked for GW retail (and I left amicably). That said, I'm going to play AoC. AoC just seems to offer alot more PvE side plus the PvP than WAR. I prefer some PvP, but I don't want that to be 95% of an MMO I'm playing. If I want that much PvP I'll jump into COD4 for a few hours. Plus, I prefer AoC's visuals to WAR's. For instance, I have yet to see a WAR movie where the character model's hair swayed in realistic fashion. That's not a knock, just a fact, for me. I prefer that kinda look .

I hope both games see success, AoC because that's where I'll be, and WAR b/c it will allow GW that extra capital to develope their others areas such as their tabletop interests, which I still play.

 

Im just curious what sort of crack your smoking to think AoC has more PvE to offer than WAR.  AoC is a giant expensive instanced version of Shadowbane.  Its almost primarily geared towards Guilds & PvP.  They talk so little about their PvE offerings it makes me wonder if they have any beyond the generic quests & end game raids.   

Apparently the same kind of crack you are smoking with the things you have just said. It seems if a game says it offers raids, that you immediately interpret that that's the only PvE it has.  I can understand that you may not have watched any of the interview videos, or that you may have a hard time understanding some of the devs speak as english isn't their native tongue, but they have said plenty about their PvE. You just have to be willing to listen, which you don't seem to be. Additionally, I'd much rather do quests where, for example, I get to interview prisoners and determine which is a murderer and is executed than kill 20 squigs in PvE to help the PvP effort.

WAR is almost 50/50 when it comes to PvE & PvP, parts of the game actually has them somewhat entertwined instead of "ok this is what you get when you pvp and this is what you get when you PvE" WAR is treating them fairly equally important factors .  (almost not completely it does slant more to rvr at end game but it still has plenty of PvE).  

Well, which is it? Completely or not?(Rhetorical question, you don't need to answer)

Its realm based instead of Guild based making it more PvE friendly to folks who don't want to slave for some ultimate evil Player Lord and just all around more PvE awsome.

And you have yet show any concrete proof of this. Indeed, you are entitled to your opinion, which I most certainly am not here to try and change, but when you type out misinformed opinion it will get pointed out.

I'm a pretty big PvE'er though I enjoy some PvPing / RvR when I feel up to it and I wouldn't touch Age of Conan with a ten foot pole even if WAR wasn't even in existance I'd never play Age of Conan due to its uber guild / pvp / RAID centricness.

I'm a huge PvEer myself, and I wouldn't tough WAR. Choice is a wonderful thing, isn't it. Especially since I'm not in an Uber guild (though I am in a guild), I like to PvP every so often (which is why I will be on a PvE server and fight in the Border Kingdoms as a mercenary for hire helping other guilds protect their Battle Keeps), and choose to raid when I feel like it (B/c I'll be able to craft items or have friends who craft items to which I insert gems that make them top tier items-The devs have stated that raid gear's primary use is for raiding and that crafted(gem slotted) items will be on par with raid items in non-raid PvE.

I guess if Visuals are all that make the game you dont' mind tons of instances.

Are we talking about GUild Wars? Cause if you are talking AoC you really aren't up to date.

 You know they're going to sacrafice alot in order to make the game hopefully work with such high graphics. 

That's you uneducated opinion. No, this is not a slight at your academic achievement, but it is pointing out the fact that you don't work at Funcom and have no idea if that is true. You don't have hands on with the technology they are using. The only ones that know are the devs.

I mean honestly who has time to sit around and watch their hair sway with the wind?  Sounds like a waste of client side CPU. 

Not if their tech can handle it. Why not add bells and whistles if all the essentials are there?

I mean EQ2 / Vanguard anyone? Both rather high graphics game adn both pretty much suck wind for actually running properly on a standard pc.

They had shiny graphics, I'll say that. Shiny as in plastic ken doll type graphics.

While AoC will do well its only going to do well with the Guild Minded / PvE high end Raid minded folks.  True PvE'ers I think will flock back to WoW or give WAR a pretty strong shot.  ( 25 - 40 man pve raids are a bastardized version of PvE).

Again, your opinion which you are entitled to.  I'm not sure when it was announced that Guild Minded and people who like to raid aren't True PvErs. I must have missed that memo. Course, we are talking your definition of True PvEr and I have no idea what that is. I do remember an AoC dev stating you can solo to level cap w/o PvP, though.

Either way, have fun in WAR as I will in AoC.

Originally posted by altairzq

Originally posted by AmazingAvery

 

Over a Play.tm short insightfull interview for those interested: link> http://play.tm/story/15992

And when you hit it, you need to actually swing your weapon manually, you need to block incoming blows, and you need to change the direction in which you hit according to how your opponent reacts. It's fun, it's exhilarating... it's real action!

This pretty much is what I have seen in that video you posted. How on earth is it fun, exhilarating and a real action??? You are just hiting left button if there is an icon on the left, or the right button if there is an icon on the right. That might be exhilarating to a 3yo maybe, or not even.

1) Have to be in range with the current weapon you are using (Longsword and polearm have different strike ranges)

2) You can string together up to 5 combos for varying effects, with some combos needing a particular side attacked

3) You can attempt to dodge your opponents strikes by moving around or jumping back out of a strike's range

Now, I mean, sure, you can just stand there in one spot and swing all day if you like, moving only to make sure your weapon is in range. You can also move around and try to strike for different sides to get different combos off, and try to string some of them together for different effects as well. Just all depends on how you want to play it I guess. The AI will also try to adjust to your strikes, so if you start spamming the same attack it "should" get diminishing returns each time.

Meh, some will like it, others want. that's nothing new. Hope you find something you like b/c it doesn't look like AoC is what you want. Best of luck!

Thanks for that video link Avery. I have an account at Gamespot and I guess I never got around to looking at their videos for AoC. I think I'll do that now, lol.