Profile: templarga
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• • DAOC Vets, post your DAOC/WAR comparisons here!

  • I am not going to go into a detailed comparison or a point by point comparison but I can say this: DAOC was about long term enjoyment and work towards success whereas WAR is about instant gratification.
    
    In DAOC, keeps took time and coordinated attacks to take. You just didn't run up, knock on the door and take it. You felt success and like your hard work was rewarded every time you took a keep. If it came under siege, you had time to gather your forces and go and fight.
    
    In WAR, it is the opposite. It is about instant gratification. You take a keep and its lost in minutes. You do not have hours to plan an attack or do you need it. Objectives are taken as fast as the other side takes them. There is constant give and take.
    
    The problem, for me at least, is that I feel like my hard work goes unrewarded. We coordinate a keep attack and before you even leave the zone it is retaken. Scenarios are instanced PVP like WOW that have no meaning other than renown and exp points. World PVP is such a give and take that it means hardly anything because you gain benefits for such a short time, you don't even notice them.
    
    This is my problem with WAR. I do like the game, but it is that - a game. There are very little lingering effects to your hardwork. A group of idiots can take a keep - it takes little skill, just a zerg.
    
    I was hoping WAR would be better than DAOC and in some ways it is. However, they destroyed the soul of PVP. After a while and once the initial rush is over, you sit there and think "Why should I bother spending 2-3 hours taking and defending this keep when 10 minutes after we leave, the zerg will take it back. In DAOC, you knew that when you took a keep, you had it for a while and the NPC's could defend it for a while.
    
    Unless Mythic makes the PVP more meaningful, I will not be resubscribing and might possibly go back to DAOC. Even after 7 years, it is still the master.

  • Posted: 10/10/08 10:29 PM
    Dark Age of Camelot
• • MMORPGs and the current economic downturn

  • Always nice to read a well thought-out and thought provoking post.
    
    I think another poster hit the proverbial nail on the head. MMO's are cheap! Very cheap by comparison. If I go to the movies right now, it is $12. That is for, at most, 3 hours of enjoyment. So let's say that is ~$4 an hour.
    
    Now let's say I play the MMO of my choice for 30 hours a month (~1 hour a day). If my math does not fail me, that is $0.50 cents an hour. And it only gets cheaper from there.
    
    Now some people will say that well you need electricity and Internet service and all of that but today those have moved from luxuries to necessities. Getting by without the Internet from home can be done but most people need it for other reasons - paying bills, keeping in contact with friends and relatives, etc... and the Internet makes that cheaper and easier. So, in reality, you are only paying for the cost of the game.
    
    What I think it will do is cause games to be worth our money even moreso than now. I am going to try and get every penny's worth of any game I subscriber too. I am not going to tolerate standing around, looking for a group, waiting in queue's, running/grinding daily quests or scenarios for exp, poor performance. Also, people will be far more intolerant of poor launches. People will not pre-order games nor wait around for them to get the "miracle patch". People will wait more and more on trials and the game to be out for months versus running out and buying it at launch.
    
    I know I have cut back on the games I am interested in. Unless I can try it and play it, I will not buy a game. This goes for MMO's and single player games too.
    
    Overall, the market will suffer some at times but in some ways, MMO's offer us many benefits and cheaper alternatives to doing other things. Every minute I am home playing an MMO, I am not out burning a hole in my wallet by putting gas in my car!! :)

  • Posted: 10/10/08 6:14 PM
    General Discussion
• • WAR passes 750,000 mark in players

  • Exactly! Glad we see eye-to-eye on that. Just wish more people understood that too. I am sick of Xfire means this or that debates. Xfire means that people who use Xfire are doing this or that and that is it.

  • Posted: 10/10/08 1:21 PM
    WAR (Warhammer Online)
• • WAR passes 750,000 mark in players

  • I agree to an extent Pheace. The problem with Xfire is that it is a BAD sample because as a smaple, there is a lot of bias. Very few people, in comparison to the gaming population use Xfire period. So already your sample would have a margin of error with a huge number.
    
    Add to that that Xfire must be added by the person and the game they play measured by it. You have to want to install it and use it. I think it is neat but it is just something else I would have running on my computer so I could care less about it.
    
    Add to that then....the majority of the gamers who use Xfire are very hardcore gamers. As I have said before, I have played MMO's since EQ and have never once had anyone in my guild use Xfire (and this is multiple guilds over the course of almost 7 years).
    
    Those gamers then are people who play many, many games or they go from game to game unlike many others.
    
    Some types of games are more common for Xfire than others.
     

    The point is that the reaons the numbers fluctuate have little to do with a game being good or bad unless it is a huge gain or drop. A few thousand players chaning means nothing. For example, I bet the week that The Force Unleashed launched saw a huge drop in a lot of games. Other games come and go because of people's interests but it does not mean anything as to the overall population or popularity of the game.
    
    That is the point I am trying to make. Xfire numbers are a simple novelty. Sure one can say this game went up and another went down; but it means only that. There is no way to prove that it is because a game is good or bad - there are way TOO many variables to take into account.

  • Posted: 10/10/08 1:15 PM
    WAR (Warhammer Online)
• • WAR passes 750,000 mark in players

  • Originally posted by OrionMan
    

    WAR drops -26% in activity over the last week. Sorry Mac, say what you want about Xfire, but this is simply absolutley historical. No game have ever dropped like this on a week to week basis (and I checked it).

    www.xfire.com/games/who/Warhammer_Online_Age_of_Reckoning/

    Happy for those 750000 sold copies, just sad that fewer and fewer of those seem to log in.

     

    Your posts are worthless and completely false. You yourself have said time and again that Xfire is great and Xfire is crap. You cannot even make up your own mind about Xfire. YOU ONLY USE XFIRE WHEN IT SUITS YOUR PUPOSES!!

    Xfire is worthless for statistics and you only hurt your argument by flip-flopping on it constantly.
    
    Wait here ya go: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/206647
     

    Check out that thread. You start talking about how great Xfire is but check out post #7 which quotes you:

    I agree. Xfire is useless and the data from those statistics are not very usefull for gauging of population numbers (in particular as AoC in fact also has some compatibility issues with Xfire). The 2% rise could however be good for one thing, which is to set an stopper for all these idiotic AoC xfire analysis posts. That's a blessing in itself.

     

    http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/2341707#2341707

     

    Now go back to the AOC forums.

  • Posted: 10/10/08 1:02 PM
    WAR (Warhammer Online)